1930 Coupe breaks

[Btmo]

Well I know this is an old topic but is there a thread here that I could find to help me fix my breaks all around? I thought about just sending my stuff in and get rebuilt replacement backing and all the stuff already done. But I would like to learn how to do it myself just because I like to learn. That is part of enjoyment along with driving it. If there is a thread or specific topic somewhere please let me know. Thanks Bill.

[DaWizard]

Hey Bill, I don't remember the subject being broached. I know myself, I went all out with a full set from Randy Gross and I tell ya, well worth the money to have everything brand spanking new and shiny. Makes my '28 Tudor stop!!

It also might help to know where you are at. Would be nice to see your location under your avatar.

[Tom Wesenberg]

The Service Bulletins have the best write up for adjusting the brakes. Bert's, Bratton's, and Snyder's all have excellent pictures of the brake assemblies.

Post pictures of what you have and show any wear, and you will get good repair tips.

[Mitch]

Bill
I do agree with Wiz there is a lot involved plus you want to go with iron drums if you don't already have them. Randys stuff is second to none but which ever way you choose to go we can walk you through it here.
This is a thread in the tech forum on setting up the brakes properly once everything is installed

https://www.vintagefordforum.com/for...ment-procedure

[Btmo]

I live in SW Missouri and just had some carpal tunnel surgery so all my tires are just sitting there. I want to be safe and so I also need better breaks. Do I need to get one of those hub pullers?

[Mitch]

Yes a hub puller will be needed to remove the rear drums.
Before you dig to deep i would purchase this excellent brake seminar which is available from most of the vendors
It shows exactly what to do and what it takes.
Lloyd Kerr " How to Stop on a Dime".

There are some critical things to look at before pulling the wheels such as the angle of the front levers, check all the brake rods for slop at the clevis pins and the service cross shaft bushings etc..

Remember when jacking up the car support it under the axles, otherwise with the suspension unloaded it will pull on the brake rods if they are still connected thus applying the brakes.

To recap when you order your puller get that DVD for 40.00

[tbirdtbird]

not to discourage anyone but to do a total and effective brake overhaul takes a chunk of time and effort and some dinero. The vid is an excellent plan. There are many places where excess play creeps into the rods, clevises, pins, etc, all contributing to weak brakes. Removing all that play is crucial.

However, once properly done, the overhaul will outlast you. As mentioned be sure to pony up for the cast iron drums; the OEM pressed steel drums are very borderline and fade . OK maybe in 1930 at 25 mph, but no longer.
When done you will have very good brakes and the car will stop safely. Most who have done the total overhaul will tell you they stop as well as hydraulics without the problems with leaks, fluid going bad, etc. I had a handicapped woman on an electric scooter zip right out in front of me from between 2 parked cars and I immediately had an image of the headline that would result: "irresponsible vintage car driver maims poor innocent handicapped woman" . She never looked. I laid on that brake pedal and locked the wheels and stopped 2" from her. My wife had covered her eyes.
Then it was home for some fresh BVDs

[Mitch]

I hope you gave her a strong AHOOGA

[H. L. Chauvin]

One (1) Opinion for fine tuning Model A Mechanical Brakes:

Near Perfect Mechanical Brakes is a result of near perfect "Brake Shoe-Brake Drum Contact Timing" for each wheel.

1. Replace all worn internal parts with new parts, new bushings everywhere, new rod pins, & cast iron drums.

2. Clevis adjustment, (backing off 1 or 2 turns until no binding), mainly equalizes the clearance & distance between brake shoe & brake drum.

3. Rod length adjustment is most important for setting "Brake Shoe-Brake Drum Contact Timing".

4. Often mentioned in all manuals is to tighten rods to remove all Free Moving "No resistance brake lever slack".

5. Often NOT mentioned is to tighten rods to "also" remove all Non-Free Moving felt "Resistance brake lever slack".

6. After clevis adjustment, and after brake rod adjustment while trying to remove all Free Moving "No resistance brake lever slack" ..... if brakes are NOT performing correctly as desired, there is a reason ............... i.e., slack is still inside the moving parts, inside the brake drum, which is preventing "Brake Shoe-Brake Drum Contact Timing" at exactly the right time ........... hence, one has to remove the Non-Free Moving felt "Resistance brake lever slack" in order to maintain desired "Brake Shoe-Brake Drum Contact Timing".

7. Some prefer real wheels to engage first, others all wheels at same time ....... however, most important is to acquire "EQUAL" "Brake Shoe-Brake Drum Contact Timing" for both right and left wheels, (front and/or rear), to avoid Model A's from pulling all to one side when pressing on the brake pedal.

8. Just for kicks, one's front timing cover's timing pin will never help to achieve "EQUAL" "Brake Shoe-Brake Drum Contact Timing" for the right and left wheels ........ just takes time and patience to remove "ALL" slack.

[Ray Horton]

The first thing I did after buying my '30 pickup 11 years ago was rebuild the BRAKES. But I didn't have an emergency stop until last week. A woman turned directly in front of me and I hit the BRAKES, stopping just as she zipped on through. I chased her for about three or four blocks as she dodged through a neighborhood. She knew I was after her and I had some choice words for her, but she was driving batsh"t crazy and she had kids in the car, so I gave it up. But the BRAKES still work great, even after 11 years!

[Big hammer]

What brake shoe linings go with the iron drums? I've already purchased iron drums with hubs and new bearings

[Mitch]

That's kinda like asking what oil to use!!
Randy Gross uses a bonded lining with great success, many install a riveted lining , so use what works for u

I have used riveted woven and they work fine but wouldn't have a problem trying the others

[tbirdtbird]

seems like a personal preference. Would love to see someone do some kind of comparative test. We use and love the riveted woven Scandinavia linings

[Tom Wesenberg]

seems like a personal preference. Would love to see someone do some kind of comparative test. We use and love the riveted woven Scandinavia linings

I do the same.

[Paul]

Les Andrews red book is a good starting place for first time brake job. It will get you there, afterwards it is learning to tweak.

Off topic: Look how close I am in number of posts to Tom

[Mitch]

Paul Welcome

[DaWizard]

Hey Paul, WELCOME to VFF !!

Off Topic......ya missed it by 1

[H. L. Chauvin]

Fwiw:

Not trying to change opinions, just relating what I heard years ago and later experienced with bonded linings.

1. Called Plasimeter years ago, where their respected technician recommended riveted brake linings over bonded linings for having better Mode A mechanical brakes.

2. Call Mr. Mel Gros, (Mr. Randy's father), quite few years later who was adamant in his providing "his" selected brand of bonded brake linings with his cast iron drums for durability and not later experiencing possible squeaking when the brakes were applied.

3. Bonded brakes, like tires, always came in many different grades from very poor quality to excellent quality, depending who makes these linings, and for what price.

4. I have Mr. Mel Gros's cast iron brake drums and bonded brake linings for the past 10 years with no problems ......after 10 years, I see no excess wear on these bonded linings ..... I can lock all four (4) wheels.

5. When I do my 1930 coupe, it will be Randy Gros's drums & Randy Gros's bonded linings .... I mean, just think ...anybody want their teenage daughter's 2018 new car to have riveted brake linings ????????

[Larrys40]

As some of the guys said I always recommend Lloyd Kerr's " How to Stop on a dime" as it really shows the details and what needs to be done. I do a lot of brake jobs ( one of my driveline specialties) and so if you should need some outside help let me know. I'm up St. Louis way not all that far from you, I work on cars from all over Missouri and surrounding states.

Doing a comprehensive brake job is more than just shoes and drums...
I will be down springfield way delivering an "A" in the next week so drop me a line of you need.
Larry Shepard

[BNCHIEF]

That is good to know Larry my son lives in the St Louis area.

[Btmo]

Wow Guys. I am at the right place. Thanks for the help. As I am healing up I will start getting some vids and parts as suggested and get ready. I appreciate the input. When I start I will need more help. Thank you. Bill

[Mitch]

Bill
Ask away that's what it's all about & get well soon

[tbirdtbird]

a very important concept is the angle of the brake actuating arm. For example, if you were looking at the left front system, the starting point for the arm should be at about 10-11 o'clock; ie tipped forward. If the starting point is closer to verticle, then as you apply the brakes you are going over-center and you will lose all ability to generate braking force. The front actuating rods are usually worn and thus too short, and the forward angle is not preserved. Maybe Purdy or somebody can get on here and explain it better than I just did

[H. L. Chauvin]

Mr. Larry Shepard's type of reply #15 is not seen too often ....... quite a compassionate and wonderful gentleman he is ..... for such a kind and helpful offer ...... just great to read and hear about Model A replies like this.

[BNCHIEF]

HL the same can be said for you your posts are well written and clear and have helped me a great deal.

[Roadster Rich]

The stop on a dime video that Mitch mentions above is great. I can only tell you that all the work that I did on the brakes in the wheel/hub did not result in nearly the impact of doing every joint from the cross shaft back. I had a huge amount of slop in the lines from the pedal to the actuator, and had tried to compensate with multiple "pills". But when I finally bit the bullet and got the reamer for the larger pins and replaced the bushings in the shaft, and the rest of what you see in the video, my brakes finally started to show for the effort. Good luck