Electric Water Pump

[DaWizard]

Waterpump 1 small.jpg
Let's try this again...

Call me crazy, insane, or just plain bonkers, I AM an electronics Wizard, have been since 1975 when I started my second electronics job repairing stereos and CB radios. I have been and always will be a gadget freak, so naturally, I rewired my Model A to 12v neg chassis. Also I likes LEDs

Now, because we are now 12v, the next step in this evolution was electric fan because I don't care who says it, a Model A is prone to over heat. They did in the 60's when I first learned about the cars, and they do NOW 50+ years later, and unless you have the mostest pristine shiny cleanest spotless radiator with an engine that has never seen water, you will have over heating problems too. Maybe not today or tomorrow, but you WILL overheat when you least expect it!

So, the next step in this evolution was the Electric Water Pump. (I actually got them both at the same time).
Now, in the picture above you will see a very nicely fitting Stewart E389A-BK14 12v electric water pump, which up until last Sunday, has been working flawlessly as intended, pumping about 55gpm through both my stock clogged radiator, and my new pristine aluminum radiator.

So, you say, what happened last Sunday? Well, I don't exactly know, but I can tell you this, I believe I toasted a 6month old Pep Bros coil, and limped home. Now I can't say for sure this is when it all happened, but I can surmise it was close to this time the pump decided it was time to fail also.

Now, after close examination, the pump has NOT failed. But it has failed to function properly, and I will explain how, the why is still out to lunch, and I will call Stewart to find out why tomorrow.

Symptom; When the engine is running, the pump isn't. So, I thought, when I turn the key on, the pump works as intended, but because I start the engine, either a voltage spike, or voltage loss stops the pump. Well, this was a good theory until.....I turned the key on, pump comes on and works, NOW, take the hand crank, turn engine over ½ turn, pump STOPS, but if the engine does not catch and fire off, the pump comes back on like gangbusters. Now all this has been done through a relay that takes volts directly from the battery and send them to the pump.

Well, to take it one step further, I unplugged the pump from the relay and hooked it directly to the battery lead, started to pump like it should, hand crank engine, at ½ turn, sputters and again, if the engine doesn't catch, begins to pump again, but if engine fires, which it usually does, extremely easy to crank start, the pump stops pumping.

So, this is a real brain twister for anyone who has ever played seriously with electronic equipment and RFI(Radio Frequency Interference) trouble shooting. It leads me to think that in the brushless motor control module there is absolutely no RF shielding or shunting. We will see tomorrow after I call them to see....and before you ask, YES, the pump chassis has been attached to the engine at the water inlet....

Results to be posted.....

I sure hope Bill doesn't read this, it will scramble his circuitry.

[Mike V. Florida]

OK, you are crazy and bonkers.

[Mike V. Florida]

What does the meter read at the pump when this happens on both ac and dc?

[DaWizard]

12v, it never looses voltage, no spike.

Just an FYI, this pump is able to run between 12v and 16v, so even when the alternator runs up to 14v, still no problems.

Since it is so close to the battery there was no AC reading. Yea, I thought about that too.

[Beauford]

WOW...now that is a add-on! pretty freak'n cool!

[Mitch]

If your power and ground is good feeding into the pump, then your pump has an internal issue. Try tapping it with a hammer when it's not running.
Now take all that off and reinstall the old school orignal set up that has worked fine for close to 90 years::;)

So you have this feeding through a basic relay?

[DaWizard]

First, thanks Mitch for removing the second pic.

Thanks Beauford, it is pretty kewl, and when it was working, it worked GREAT!!

Now, on to the meat of it.

I HAD it feeding through a 40amp relay, but then took that totally out of the picture and hooked it directly to the battery. Same results, ½ crank by HAND, pump sputters, stops, and if engine doesn't catch and run, pump starts again, but if engine runs, pump stops!

Just got off the phone with Stewart Components and this is not the first time this has happened, so, we are addressing it.

[DaWizard]

UPDATE: Since talking to a fellow at Stewart, he needs to confer with the "electrical engineers" to properly address this situation and because he didn't get back to me today, I am thinking that I was the smarter of the 2 of us on the phone and I HOPE he can convey the correct information to an engineer or at least to someone I can have an intelligent conversation with for tomorrow.

Oh, just so you all know, the Beast is back to stock configuration with a steel 4 blade fan. I HAVE to drive it and I will NOT let a little thing like a bad pump stop me. I have the parts!!

[Mitch]

now your good for another 85.5 years as long as your steel fan doesn't blow apart

[DaWizard]

Oh, one other thing, I let the old radiator soak a few hours in vinegar, managed to flush out some nice sized chips of rust, now, perhaps the inline filter I have can finish off the rest, if any remaining.