Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Painting tip

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Painting tip

    What is pictured are not Model A fenders. No matter, the principle is the same.
    I am referring to painting the inside of deep-drawn fenders such as the A rear fenders.
    Such a task is a challenge.
    Once all the metal work is complete, we can attack the plastic work needed and shoot the insides.

    First, because of the concavity, the paint wants to pepper back at you. You are shooting into a deep hole.
    Second, because of the lips that need painting, this is another challenge, you need to be at a right angle to the lip.

    There would be many ways to solve these problems. This is what we do here (fenders are from a '47 Stude M5 pickup, fronts and rears are the same)
    We break the shoot up into 2 parts.
    Part 1 we shoot the mounting lip and a reasonable amount of the main part of the fender, about half-way up.
    Part 2 next day we flip the fender and shoot the other half.

    All the major paint manufacturers carry blending agents for use for blending panels for collision repair. PPG calls their product Blend-Ease.
    Blend Ease will bite into previously cured paint for a good bond and blend.
    Now, for collision work, you would scuff the entire panel, then limit your shoot to the repaired area for the first 2 coats. On the 3rd coat, you add BlendEase at a rate of 50%, and shoot the entire panel.

    We slightly modify this mix as follows:
    The second day we add about 5% BlendEase to the mix in the gun, and then shoot as many coats as we want. For the insides of fenders, we use 2 coats, since we will not be buffing the paint. We do not scuff what we did in Part 1.

    On exterior work, you would shoot 3 coats since you will be wet sanding off most of the last coat. Recall one coat of paint is about 1 mil.

    Also, we will shoot down to about 50° temp, because we use accelerator. O/W 50° is too cold for the urethane to cure. The air temp for these fenders both days was 50°.

    BTW that dull battleship gray color of the metal is because we spray down all blasted steel with phosphoric acid, which is a passivating agent for steel and cast. Once done, it can be stored indoors for literally years and not rust. I have a spare Model A frame stashed in the shop that was blasted and passivated 30 yrs ago and there is not a speck of rust. The color you are looking at is iron phosphate, and can be directly painted over. This way, we can metal work the fenders in small bites and not be rushed to spray on epoxy or something that would just get in the way of metal repair

    Should you decide to use phosphoric acid for this purpose, some of the bottles say to wash it off after with water. Do NOT do this, you have just washed away the acid and its resulting protection

    BlendEase.jpg


    fenders2.jpg

    fenders3.jpg
    Last edited by tbirdtbird; 01-11-2018, 01:03 AM.

  • #2
    A Model A "Tip" written by a Model A owner seems to always appear to have a very special Common-Sense solution to resolve a very interesting, unique Model A restoration problem.

    No matter the particular subject, just seeing the word "Model A Tip" can draw attention from serious Model A restorers.

    Thanks for taking the time to share unique, detailed educational painting information with photos, not often explained in such detail in painting manuals.

    Comment


    • #3
      Great post, Dave. As a do-it-yourselfer I painted my Tudor in 1980 with the materials and knowledge that was available at the time, and the paint still looks good after 38 years. But today I wouldn't even begin to attempt it. Paint chemistry, equipment, and laws, not to mention material costs, have changed so much I don't know how the average guy could paint his own car anymore.

      Comment


      • tbirdtbird
        tbirdtbird commented
        Editing a comment
        Ray, I kinda know what your saying, but you cut your teeth on a different system, prolly lacquer or enamel.
        It is not as hard as people think, and I don't know how anyone can afford to pay a commercial paint shop!!!!

        There is plenty of painting advice available right here. The super strict laws pertain to a commercial shop, and as long as you are not in California you can do it!!! The urethanes lay down very easily.

        Glad your paint is holding up, that is a testament to the skills you have. Stop by some day, and I'll put an HVLP gun in your hand and fill it with some urethane paint and you'll be off and running like you did it your whole life. If you could paint 38 yrs ago you can paint now. Just like riding a bike
        Last edited by tbirdtbird; 01-11-2018, 04:30 PM.

      • Ray Horton
        Ray Horton commented
        Editing a comment
        Dave, you're right. Lacquer on the body and enamel on the fenders and aprons. No runs, easy rub out, no crackled surfaces later. I think it was just dumb luck, looking back on all the things that could have gone wrong! If you were closer I'd take up your offer to try out some of the new stuff. At my age I think I have finished my last car, though.

    • #4
      Dave this super information, and for a non painter like me i learned some things. Thanks for taking the time to documenting this procedure. One thing i would do different is buff the inside of the fenders


      [video=youtube_share;BoPlsitDZ9Q]https://youtu.be/BoPlsitDZ9Q[/video]
      3~ Tudor's & 1~ Coupe
      Henry Ford said,
      "It's all nuts and bolts"
      "Start by doing what's necessary; then do what's possible; and suddenly you are doing the impossible."

      Mitch's Auto Service ctr

      Comment


      • tbirdtbird
        tbirdtbird commented
        Editing a comment
        just shoot 3 coats instead of 2

        Kool vid, a scotch brite pad would have made it easier
        Last edited by tbirdtbird; 01-12-2018, 12:34 AM.

    • #5
      Thanks Tbird, very good tip.

      Comment

      Related Topics

      Collapse

      • wrndln
        Another couple paint questions
        by wrndln
        I need to touch up a few very small flaws in my front fenders. These are not the colorsanding break thru's I recently posted here on VFF. These are about the size of a straight pin's head. The fender are painted with PPG Concept 9300 black. I have the same 9300 black paint I am going to use to touch up the fenders. My question is: Will the paint I use to touch up the very small flaws work OK...
        09-29-2019, 06:55 PM
      • BillLee/Chandler, TX
        Too much catalyst
        by BillLee/Chandler, TX
        What happens if you use too much catalyst when preparing some urethane paint? How does the paint react? How does it spray? Flow out?
        09-19-2018, 01:45 PM
      • tbirdtbird
        More on prep for painting using phosphoric acid such as Ospho with pic
        by tbirdtbird
        I am forever promoting using this prep for freshly blasted metal or otherwise cleaned.
        This is a hood from the M5 I am working on. Like all the other sheet metal, it was water blasted a year ago. The water blasters put in a special chemical to stop it from flash rusting, but that stuff only lasts a day or two.

        Few people are prepared to prime their sheet metal immediately, esp since...
        02-19-2018, 10:56 PM
      • old31
        Great paint job (not Model A)
        by old31
        We have all seen good and great paint jobs. I just had to share this job, because it is probably the best I have ever seen.

        The picture is not from the actual car but from the reflection from the car next to it. Click on the pic to make it larger. That ain't no rattle can Rustoleum special that I can do.

        ...
        08-17-2019, 11:23 AM
      • tbirdtbird
        More on prep for painting using phosphoric acid such as Ospho with pic
        by tbirdtbird
        Original Thread


        I am forever promoting using this prep for freshly blasted metal or otherwise cleaned.
        This is a hood from the M5 I am working on. Like all the other sheet metal, it was water blasted a year ago. The water blasters put in a special chemical to stop it from flash rusting, but that stuff only lasts a day or two.

        Few people are prepared to prime...
        02-19-2018, 10:56 PM
      • tbirdtbird
        Painting tip #66 from the paint doctor
        by tbirdtbird
        I have had some PM exchanges with a couple folks doing their own shooting. 2 issues have arisen that are worth bringing to the open forum.
        1) Edges
        gotta get 4 coats. The rest of the panel/fender whatever gets 3. Shoot all edges first

        2) Overlap when shooting
        In the professional world you gotta overlap each pass of the gun by 50% of the preceding pass. That is considered...
        09-17-2019, 06:48 PM
      • Great Lakes Greg
        Paint inquiry
        by Great Lakes Greg
        I settled in for an evening of wet sanding my fender and I discovered that I had sprayed black too thin, and the primer was showing through in an area by the running board. Can I spot the black in, or do I have to shoot the whole fender? This is regarding the color only. I know I have to clear everything when I am done. This is a urethane base / clear, if that matters....
        You do not have permission to view this gallery.
        This gallery has 1 photos.
        08-15-2019, 07:55 PM
      • JohnB15632
        Time between Priming and final coat
        by JohnB15632
        I am finally finished with stripping my A and all of its parts. I am getting ready to prime coat the A and all of its parts.
        I found out today that the paint I am applying for the prime can be applied at 60 degrees F. The top coat can not be applied until the temperatures get above 75 degree F.

        Question. If I get a couple of 60 deg days, I can prime. However, how long can the A...
        You do not have permission to view this gallery.
        This gallery has 1 photos.
        03-21-2019, 11:29 AM
      • wrndln
        Colorsanding
        by wrndln
        I have done a fair amount of colorsanding on my cars. However, it was some time (weeks) after I painted the items before colorsanding them. I just painted my fenders today and would like to know how long before they can safely be colorsanded. I would like to colorsand them ASAP, but I want to be safe in doing it. If anyone Is knowledgeable about colorsanding, please post a response.
        Thanks...
        09-02-2019, 06:54 PM
      • KenJT
        Model A paint
        by KenJT
        While draining old gas from my car some got on the paint and ruined a small area. I believe the color is Bronson yellow. Can anyone tell me where I might buy some of this color or a close equivalent? Thanks in advance.
        08-19-2021, 09:24 AM
      Working...
      X